lol @ the EPL

Discussion in 'Association Football Discussion' started by Toolman, Apr 5, 2013.

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  1. GIMH GIMH Martyn

    I imagine in such a system it'd be like this

    3rd v 6th
    4th v 5th

    3rd/6th v 4th/5th

    3/4/5/6 v 2nd

    2/3/4/5/6 v 1st

    Or some such bollocks which means 1st only have to play the final.
     
    GIMH, Apr 5, 2013
    #21

  2. Lukic L Popovic

    Playoffs/final series make sense in a non-tiered non-progressive table structure.

    It doesn't make sense in anything else at all because it simply takes away from the value of prior matches.

    Does Man United having the title wrapped up at such an early point suck from a entertainment point of view? Yes, but they've earned it because their competition couldn't beat them when it mattered. To an extent, the league system is a playoff in itself because when you're competing for a title, every game is a must win if you want to keep up.
     
    Lukic, Apr 5, 2013
    #22

  3. Cribbage RG Cribb

    Any finals system worth its toffee gives 1 a massive advantage over 6. Home games, two bites at the cherry, playing lower ranked sides etc etc. The higher you finish, the better.

    No finals system means 1 > 2 = every other position.
    A six team final system would mean 1 > 2 > 3 > 4 > 5 > 6 > 7 = every other position.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2013
    Cribbage, Apr 5, 2013
    #23

  4. MrPrez CM Dyer

    Even so, if you cut down the season to 6 months with 2 months of playoffs (extreme example), that's still 6 months of performance you're negating for one bad game.
     
    MrPrez, Apr 5, 2013
    #24

  5. Toolman TR Man

    There's obviously a benefit to finishing 1st in competitions with finals series.
     
    Toolman, Apr 5, 2013
    #25

  6. Speirz DG Speirs

    That's a better system than the one we use at the moment I'd reckon.

    I'd actually love to see the Community Shield played at the end of the current season rather than the start of the next, because you've theoretically got the most consistent team v the team that performs best under pressure. Having it with different squads at the start of the next season makes it a glorified friendly.
     
    Speirz, Apr 5, 2013
    #26

  7. Lukic L Popovic

    The problem with finals series specifically in football from a pure sporting point of view and not organisational is the high variance of the sport.

    In rugby league, generally whatever sport, the better and more deserving team is going to win 95% of the time. In football, not only do you have the draw, but there's just the potential for a team to get one chance, take it and the other to spend all day in around the opposition's box and come away with nothing be it due to bad luck or resolute defending (which of course is a legitimate tactic, but then if you're after entertainment, rewarding a team who can bus is counter intuitive).

    Finals systems also don't make sense to me in sports without salary caps.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2013
    Lukic, Apr 5, 2013
    #27

  8. Cabinet96 OTN Wood

    True, but even without the finals there's still benefits for finishing a couple of places above somewhere else. European qualification and financial reasons being the obvious ones.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2013
    Cabinet96, Apr 5, 2013
    #28

  9. Speirz DG Speirs

    The weirdest thing about this is that the World Cup is decided by a finals series, and nobody really ever suggests that they adopt some sort of league format. Yet people constantly suggest finals systems to be added to the domestic competitions. I wonder if anyone would prefer it if the top 8 teams after the group stage of the World Cup went into a league situation?
     
    Speirz, Apr 5, 2013
    #29

  10. GIMH GIMH Martyn

    This isn't true though, again because of the pyramid. Can see that though in Aussie/American stuctures, which again is I guess why culturally finals series make a lot more sense there.
     
    GIMH, Apr 5, 2013
    #30

  11. GIMH GIMH Martyn

    I think there is too much that makes it a logistical nightmare for it to ever work. It's not like we don't like finals in football either. The audiences for the World Cup Final/CHampions League Final/FA Cup Final are all massive globally IIRC.
     
    GIMH, Apr 5, 2013
    #31

  12. MrPrez CM Dyer

    It would take too long. And it would have to be renamed.
     
    MrPrez, Apr 5, 2013
    #32

  13. Cabinet96 OTN Wood

    I wouldn't personally be against it, but it would mean the competition takes a lot longer. Given they've only got a small window in the Northern Hemisphere summer, doing something which would take two months wouldn't be that popular amongst the players.
     
    Cabinet96, Apr 5, 2013
    #33

  14. GIMH GIMH Martyn

    It being renamed would hardly be an issue, it's happened before
     
    GIMH, Apr 5, 2013
    #34

  15. Speirz DG Speirs

    The biggest argument against that is that with a finals series, the revenues for the league and clubs would increase pretty significantly I imagine. If the league is in a position to make more money by selling a finals series, they'd also be in a position to offer more prizemoney on top of the extra match day and merchandising opportunities.

    I'm actually well in favour of the league only set up, because football competitions tend to nail the structure of it perfectly. The ones that don't like the A-League and MLS use a finals system to attempt compensate for the imperfections within their league draw, on top of the other benefits I mentioned.
     
    Speirz, Apr 5, 2013
    #35

  16. MrPrez CM Dyer

    Yeah I know, just having a yarn :p
     
    MrPrez, Apr 5, 2013
    #36

  17. Speirz DG Speirs

    Cutting back the length of some of the seasons in Europe wouldn't be the worst thing in the world IMO.
     
    Speirz, Apr 5, 2013
    #37

  18. Lukic L Popovic

    The world cup really sits on the edge of a number of things.

    I don't like the fact it's every 4 years since a team can change so much in 4 years and it also limits a golden generation of a certain country from even getting the chance to compete it they screw up a couple games in qualifying or have a mishap in the group stages. But then if you do shorten it to 2 or 3 years, you're removing from the prestige of the tournament as you have a different champion in a shorter period. I suppose having the euros every 2nd year in between is nice, but I'd personally like to see the WC every 3 years.

    Thread worthy or not?
     
    Lukic, Apr 5, 2013
    #38

  19. Toolman TR Man

    Most of the season consists of those games, and the championship is basically decided on which one of them avoids drawing to the noob teams and the random loss when the team wasn't psychologically fully prepared (unlike a finals game where they would be). They haven't earned it unless they beat the top teams. The way it's set up doesn't allow them to prove this completely. Apparently last season was one of the most exciting finishes ever. IMO it would have been much more exciting if that last game was Man Utd v Man City.

    And obv. you'd still have the same champions league qualifications etc. on the original standings. You just have the top 6 and the same finals series as the A league.

    Even Champions league isn't that exciting in comparison because you don't have a full season of build up into it. The games would be of such a higher quality as well IMO than what you're treated to when the big teams face up in regular season.
     
    Toolman, Apr 5, 2013
    #39

  20. GIMH GIMH Martyn

    So you could be the champions of England and not qualify for the Champions League? lol
     
    GIMH, Apr 5, 2013
    #40
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